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Survey Pro glitch???

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T-Ray
(@t-ray)
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Long story hopefully as short as possible.

Yesterday I used the latest Survey Pro software in Ranger 3 with a Trimble S5 1" robot to do a 2 point resection. I ran 3 sets of angles to both points on a site I have great control on with elevations run with a digital level. The residuals came back 0.00 HZ and 0.01 VZ (one point was about 700' away so expected a small vert error). With Survey Pro after the resection it automatically sets your backsite to a roving target and I don't like this so I always do a new setup on the point I just established and set  it to a Fixed backsite. My check to the backsite came back 0.00 HZ and 0.24 vert. I checked the 2nd (closer) point I used as a resection point and it was off 0.06 vert. Ran the resection again checking everything from measure ups to prism type etc and even added in another point. Residuals 0.00 HZ and 0.00 vert. Backsite check 0.24' vert. Checked another control point 0.11 vert. Did a remote elevation from that control point (direct and reverse) then staked out to my resection points and they were all off, this time I noticed the further they were away the bigger the error. Figured my robots vertical has gone south so loaded it up and shipped it off to to fixed. Back to the office to get the S6 2". Set on same resection point and checked the BS for 0.04 vert which I thought was reasonable considering it was 700'+. Then checked the last point I had staked Thursday and was 0.02 (also a longer shot). Ran with that and staked about 800' of curb and checked into a different control point 0.20 vert. Checked into a point I staked the week before near that CP 0.18'....WTF is happening here???? Checked my BS for you guessed it 0.24 vert!!! Turned everything off and started again and the BS checked for 0.04, then checked all the points I just staked and they were all off 0.07 to 0.15' vert. Fixed all those points then checked into the point from Thursday 0.02 again. I am totally baffled now! In my opinion it can only be the Survey Pro software giving me bad data. I am going to copy all my projects from my main DC to my backup and see what happens. Has anyone ever seen this happen and if so did you ever come to any resolution?

 

Thanks for reading!

Trey

 
Posted : September 17, 2022 11:42 am
R.J. Schneider
(@rj-schneider)
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Posted by: @t-ray

Yesterday I used the latest Survey Pro software in Ranger 3

Just a guess, and so there's some discussion, you're latest version of SP isn't;

Enabling your compensator

Applying the different corrections to your raw file

Taking into account the different corrections in calc your xyz

 

Stay tuned for more of the usual bromides.

 

 
Posted : September 17, 2022 1:55 pm
MI-Other-Left
(@michigan-left)
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I seem to recall one time when the "measure to" point got mixed up or didn't stay the same within different apps within Survey Pro.

Depending on the height of your leveling screws on your tribrach for an S series instrument (at the "0" line, or +/-), the height from the top of the tripod head to the "Bottom of Notch" on Trimble instruments is right around 0.25'.

 
Posted : September 17, 2022 3:28 pm
Brad Ott reacted

Lurker
(@lurker)
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post the raw data so we can see what might be going on.

 
Posted : September 17, 2022 8:22 pm
Brad Ott and Rover83 reacted
Rover83
(@rover83)
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Are we sure there's not a problem with the vertical on project control?

I too would like a crack at the raw data...

 
Posted : September 18, 2022 7:50 am
mvanhank222
(@mvanhank222)
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I was a long time Survey Pro user switched to magnet last year. Survey pro uses a 3d resection vs 2d+h. It will weight the V error vs the distance it could make a .1 error in 500’ look like .02 if the distances are drastically different.

 
Posted : September 18, 2022 12:35 pm

T-Ray
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@rover83 definitely not a problem.

 
Posted : September 18, 2022 2:02 pm
T-Ray
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   Here is the RAW as a .txt BS points were 20 & 30

 
Posted : September 18, 2022 2:13 pm
MI-Other-Left
(@michigan-left)
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@t-ray 

I could be a big dummy here, but this file doesn't appear to contain the complete header info, nor the fixed coordinates for points 20 and 30?

 
Posted : September 18, 2022 5:56 pm

T-Ray
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@michigan-left yes the full raw was 124 pages so I just deleted everything prior to this day.

 
Posted : September 18, 2022 6:00 pm
T-Ray
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@mvanhank222 how do you like Magnet? Will it drive a Trimble Robot?

 
Posted : September 18, 2022 6:01 pm
mvanhank222
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Magnet won’t run Trimble it is a Topcon product. I like it so far some small things I don’t like but nothing insurmountable.

This post was modified 6 days ago by mvanhank222
 
Posted : September 18, 2022 6:08 pm

MI-Other-Left
(@michigan-left)
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@t-ray

Do you have the coordinates for those 2 points, and some metadata about the coordinate system? (SPC? Zone? Survey Feet? Etc?)

It's kinda difficult to check a resection if we don't have those 2 points.

Or at least Trimble Business Center is yelling at me becuase it can't establish a back bearing.

 
Posted : September 18, 2022 6:09 pm
Jitterboogie reacted
T-Ray
(@t-ray)
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20,2218210.97,2329070.45,2152.18,mini

30,2218201.41,2329838.54,2154.26,5REB-LSI-CTRL

 

These are ground coordinates Idaho West

 
Posted : September 18, 2022 6:12 pm
Lurker
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I'm just part way through the raw but you seem to have a problem when sighting pn30 you have about 20 seconds difference in your zenith from the resection sighting to the backsight sighting resulting in 0.06' difference. This shouldn't be that different at only 627'. I'll continue looking at the raw. Why is there not a rod height when sighting the generic prism on pn20 during the resection?

 
Posted : September 18, 2022 7:14 pm

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