Notifications
Clear all

Survey Pro glitch???

30 Posts
10 Users
9 Likes
658 Views
Lurker
(@lurker)
Posts: 611
Member Member
 

So some assumptions I'm making; occupied points 31,32, and 33 are all the same point and instrument setup. The only difference is they are different solved resections. Just in considering all the observations from occupied to backsight at 30 you have various zenith angles 89-22-00, 89-22-32, 89-21-32, 89-23-29, 89-20-25, 89-19-37. This is way too much variation for a single stable set up. It looks as if something is wrong. Also, for some reason the instrument height changes from 5.79 to 5.74. Again I'm assuming the instrument was never moved during this whole time. I didn't evaluate what survey pro calced but without further explanation there appears to be something wrong with the raw observations.

The vertical circle of the instrument appears to be very reasonable but there is something influencing the vertical sighting to point 30 that is definitely not correct.

 
Posted : September 18, 2022 8:06 pm
Rover83
(@rover83)
Posts: 1601
Member Member
 
Posted by: @lurker

Again I'm assuming the instrument was never moved during this whole time. I didn't evaluate what survey pro calced but without further explanation there appears to be something wrong with the raw observations.

Agree. Looking at the raw data file, I don't see much in the way of additional checks, but maybe it got clipped out.

It's possible, but extremely rare, for the field software to record incorrectly values. I would suspect either bad control, a bust in the setup, or something going on procedurally.

 

Did I read correctly upthread that there was another set of observations taken with another instrument? If that is correct, and you were seeing the same problems, I would suspect bad vertical in the control.

If you really wanted to rule out Survey Pro, you could sight the points and book all the angles, then manually record the slope distance and reduce things in the office.

 

 
Posted : September 19, 2022 7:41 am
T-Ray
(@t-ray)
Posts: 184
Member Member
Topic starter
 

@lurker

I use these mounted on different objects for control and just call them 0.00 rod height

 
Posted : September 20, 2022 7:08 am
Lurker reacted

Get the 2023 SurveyorConnect Wall Calendar

T-Ray
(@t-ray)
Posts: 184
Member Member
Topic starter
 

@lurker @rover83 The difference in the HI was the difference between the S5 and S6 setups. I didn't store any other checks because everything I shot was way off vertically but physically checked 4 other points including 2 control points and 2 previously set points. All the control has been run with a digital level and checked with the same S5. I am going to go through the raw this weekend because I staked out a bunch of points using and alignment then checked in bad vertically then got the gun to give me the correct vertical then reshot those points and put new grades on them. So basically I have 2 sets of data for each point so that should at least show me what's going on, still not sure why that would be happening. I appreciate the input from all..... stay tuned!

 
Posted : September 20, 2022 7:19 am
Lurker
(@lurker)
Posts: 611
Member Member
 

@t-ray

I'm kind of curious how you used a digital level to put an elevation on those prisms that you use 0 for the rod height.

Something needs to explain the different zenith angles back to pn30. I see that you had 2 different set ups so I would expect 2 groups of the zenith angles to be relatively close within themselves but it appears both setups had large variations when sighting pn30. A variation of 00-00-15 would equal 0.045' which should be easily accomplished at that distance. These variations are significantly greater so something is wrong with those observations.

 
Posted : September 20, 2022 7:30 am
Rover83
(@rover83)
Posts: 1601
Member Member
 
Posted by: @lurker

I'm kind of curious how you used a digital level to put an elevation on those prisms that you use 0 for the rod height.

I agree. How did those points get positioned at the start of the project? I do a LOT of troubleshooting for similar issues, and one of the most common causes is that the control was not properly positioned (or was positioned with poor precision) at the beginning of the project.

Also, two different stations, same results? Highly unlikely that it is an instrumentation problem.

It's either a really bad bug in the software (again, very rare but possible), something wrong with procedures (hard to tell, I'm a little suspicious of the method of switching from a resect to a single-backsight, even though in theory it should be fine), or something wrong with the control.

 
Posted : September 20, 2022 8:31 am

Get the 2023 SurveyorConnect Wall Calendar

Norman Oklahoma
(@norman-oklahoma)
Posts: 6683
Member Member
 

Here is the data in StarNet format. A little easier to read, I think. If you post coordinates for 26, in addition to 20 and 30 that you have already done,  I can run it in StarNet and maybe learn something.  Running with just 20 and 30 it looks like there is a elevation problem with the control, but I'd like to have that other point. 

Your first resection set has no Hi/Hr data (assumes 0.00 on both) - which obviously doesn't work. 

I notice that you have the EDM in tracking mode quite a lot, which probably isn't the source of your problem, but it doesn't help.  

 

# STAR*TDS Version 11.0.6.2263
# Copyright © 2021 MicroSurvey Software Inc.MicroSurvey Software Inc.

# Input Field File : C:\Users\mmayer\Downloads\PF-RAB-SPK-PRAIRE.txt
# Date Processed : 09-20-2022 08:21:55

.Units FeetInt
.Units DMS
.Order AtFromTo
.Sep -
.Delta Off
.3D

# C 31 2218271.54361 2329214.92237 2146.72914 '60D TEMP
# C 32 2218271.54010 2329214.92096 2146.95011 '60D TEMP
# C 33 2218271.54516 2329214.91590 2146.65584 '60D TEMP
# C 1648 2218190.97533 2329322.65882 2145.82105 'PT15
# C 1649 2218206.70060 2329581.85914 2142.77581 'PT487
# C 1650 2218207.44387 2329540.80383 2142.64803 '127+10.00 R 41.5
# C 1651 2218207.97145 2329510.00510 2142.84785 '126+79.19 R 41.5
# C 1652 2218208.46308 2329480.81055 2143.16786 '126+50.00 R 41.5
# C 1653 2218207.32364 2329430.75931 2143.04838 '126+00.00 R 43.5
# C 1654 2218209.21632 2329380.80626 2143.69029 '125+50.00 R 42.5
# C 1655 2218211.05549 2329330.81242 2145.30279 '125+00.00 R 41.5
# C 1656 2218211.90021 2329280.82709 2145.73786 '124+50.00 R 41.5
# C 1657 2218212.78724 2329230.86443 2146.38425 '124+00.00 R 41.5
# C 1658 2218213.65059 2329180.85049 2146.73464 '123+50.00 R 41.5
# C 1659 2218214.50081 2329130.84851 2146.83934 '123+00.00 R 41.5
# C 1660 2218213.32262 2329080.84044 2146.61495 '122+50.00 R 43.5
# C 1661 2218216.19641 2329030.85910 2147.14663 '122+00.00 R 41.5
# C 1662 2218217.06382 2328980.88701 2147.72458 '121+50.00 R 41.5
# C 1663 2218217.90442 2328930.88148 2148.82358 '121+00.00 R 41.5
# C 1664 2218218.77973 2328880.90236 2149.33852 '120+50.00 R 41.5
# C 1665 2218219.63468 2328830.91175 2150.64134 '120+00.00 R 41.5
# C 1666 2218219.64850 2328830.88677 2150.83276 '120+00.00 R 41.5
# C 1667 2218218.77421 2328880.92525 2149.49498 '120+50.00 R 41.5
# C 1668 2218217.92660 2328930.88394 2148.92022 '121+00.00 R 41.5
# C 1669 2218217.07047 2328980.88227 2147.80197 '121+50.00 R 41.5
# C 1670 2218216.21115 2329030.86305 2147.22656 '122+00.00 R 41.5
# C 1671 2218213.32740 2329080.84800 2146.66953 '122+50.00 R 43.5
# C 1672 2218214.48924 2329130.84085 2146.86004 '123+00.00 R 41.5
# C 1673 2218213.64073 2329180.84469 2146.74586 '123+50.00 R 41.5
# C 1674 2218212.75951 2329230.85599 2146.36083 '124+00.00 R 41.5
# C 1675 2218211.90782 2329280.80100 2145.69772 '124+50.00 R 41.5
# C 1676 2218211.05439 2329330.81453 2145.23667 '125+00.00 R 41.5
# C 1677 2218209.20004 2329380.82665 2143.61092 '125+50.00 R 41.5
# C 1678 2218207.30984 2329430.75979 2143.01012 '126+00.00 R 41.5
# C 1679 2218208.43698 2329480.79968 2143.04343 '126+50.00 R 41.5
# C 1680 2218207.94930 2329509.97958 2142.69777 '126+79.19 R 41.5
# C 1681 2218207.41619 2329540.78777 2142.48642 '127+10.00 R 41.5
# C 1682 2218206.71024 2329581.85507 2142.70153 'PT487
# C 1683 2218220.10169 2328802.89063 2150.68156 '119+72.00 R 41.5
# C 1684 2218219.25697 2328793.90353 2150.60897 '119+63.00 R 42.5
# C 1685 2218220.73848 2328765.90528 2151.75639 '119+35.00 R 41.5
# C 1686 2218342.84582 2328703.61782 2153.19063 'PT457
# C 1687 2218320.87063 2328707.36364 2153.41801 'PT453
# C 1688 2218312.92547 2328713.42779 2153.82198 'PT452
# C 1689 2218306.65990 2328723.20325 2152.71682 'PT451
# C 1690 2218304.28457 2328734.57269 2152.73080 'PT450
# C 1691 2218304.28136 2328734.64201 2152.72526 '119+02.96 L 41.5
# C 1692 2218303.74802 2328765.21123 2152.46700 '119+32.86 L 41.5
# C 1693 2218303.25572 2328795.33149 2151.43701 '119+63.00 L 41.5
# C 1694 2218303.08277 2328804.30668 2151.41018 '119+72.00 L 41.5
# C 1695 2218302.60467 2328832.35452 2150.60173 '120+00.00 L 41.5
# C 1696 2218301.75102 2328882.32171 2149.57962 '120+50.00 L 41.5
# C 1697 2218300.89764 2328932.32104 2148.83959 '121+00.00 L 41.5
# C 1698 2218300.03423 2328982.33287 2148.31511 '121+50.00 L 41.5
# C 1699 2218299.16929 2329032.30332 2147.82811 '122+00.00 L 41.5
# C 1700 2218298.33785 2329082.28443 2146.89360 '122+50.00 L 41.5
# C 1701 2218297.47978 2329132.28924 2146.52260 '123+00.00 L 41.5
# C 1702 2218296.60471 2329182.27542 2146.10502 '123+50.00 L 41.5
# C 1703 2218295.74873 2329232.27810 2145.47694 '124+00.00 L 41.5
# C 1704 2218294.90732 2329282.24673 2144.84629 '124+50.00 L 41.5
# C 1705 2218294.03846 2329332.26097 2144.46735 '125+00.00 L 41.5
# C 1706 2218293.16246 2329382.25963 2144.24953 '125+50.00 L 41.5
# C 1707 2218292.31795 2329432.24564 2143.59276 '126+00.00 L 41.5
# C 1708 2218291.65423 2329472.22393 2143.66847 '126+40.00 L 41.5
# C 1709 2218290.96448 2329511.42326 2143.12091 '126+79.19 L 41.5
# C 1710 2218290.59249 2329532.23312 2143.26867 '127+00.00 L 41.5
# C 1711 2218290.07956 2329562.20901 2143.86877 '127+30.00 L 41.5

DB 31
DM 30 0-00-00.00 627.5958 89-21-59.58
DM 30 359-59-58.06 627.5910 89-22-01.53
DM 30 359-59-59.68 627.5923 89-22-00.88
DM 30 359-59-56.11 627.5943 89-22-02.17
DM 30 359-59-57.73 627.5891 89-22-01.53
DM 30 359-59-54.82 627.5930 89-22-04.76
DM 20 150-50-06.18 156.6574 90-04-42.85
DM 20 150-50-09.42 156.6623 90-04-39.61
DM 20 150-50-06.83 156.6613 90-04-41.88
DM 20 150-50-09.42 156.6601 90-04-38.96
DM 20 150-50-06.18 156.6591 90-04-41.23
DM 20 150-50-09.74 156.6551 90-04-37.34
DE

DV 31-30 627.5894 89-22-19.67 5.790/5.255 '5REBS LSI CTRL
DV 31-30 627.5938 89-22-24.53 5.790/5.255 '5REBS LSI CTRL

DB 32
DM 20 0-00-00.00 156.6594 90-04-08.83 5.790/5.255
DM 20 0-00-00.65 156.6567 90-04-12.40 5.790/5.255
DM 20 359-59-58.70 156.6551 90-04-09.16 5.790/5.255
DM 20 0-00-01.94 156.6566 90-04-13.37 5.790/5.255
DM 20 359-59-58.70 156.6575 90-04-09.16 5.790/5.255
DM 20 0-00-01.94 156.6602 90-04-12.40 5.790/5.255
DM 30 209-09-46.69 627.5970 89-22-34.25 5.790/5.255
DM 30 209-09-44.75 627.5919 89-22-35.54 5.790/5.255
DM 30 209-09-46.69 627.5955 89-22-32.30 5.790/5.255
DM 30 209-09-44.42 627.5906 89-22-35.22 5.790/5.255
DM 30 209-09-45.72 627.5966 89-22-29.71 5.790/5.255
DM 30 209-09-43.78 627.5928 89-22-32.63 5.790/5.255
DE

DV 32-30 627.5981 89-22-27.12 5.790/5.255 '5REBS LSI CTRL
DV 32-30 627.5847 89-23-29.00 5.790/5.255 '5REBS LSI CTRL

DB 31
DM 30 0-00-00.00 627.5873 89-21-31.07 5.790/5.255
DM 30 359-59-59.35 627.5840 89-21-30.75 5.790/5.255
DM 30 0-00-02.59 627.5881 89-21-32.37 5.790/5.255
DM 30 0-00-00.65 627.5861 89-21-29.78 5.790/5.255
DM 30 0-00-02.27 627.5884 89-21-30.42 5.790/5.255
DM 30 0-00-02.59 627.5862 89-21-28.16 5.790/5.255
DM 20 150-50-14.93 156.6574 90-05-13.31 5.790/5.255
DM 20 150-50-18.17 156.6518 90-05-15.90 5.790/5.255
DM 20 150-50-14.28 156.6585 90-05-15.90 5.790/5.255
DM 20 150-50-20.11 156.6525 90-05-18.17 5.790/5.255
DM 20 150-50-15.58 156.6540 90-05-17.84 5.790/5.255
DM 20 150-50-19.79 156.6537 90-05-18.82 5.790/5.255
DM 26 169-14-14.14 674.0411 89-28-05.48 5.790/5.255
DM 26 169-14-15.76 674.0337 89-28-08.40 5.790/5.255
DM 26 169-14-15.76 674.0389 89-28-07.43 5.790/5.255
DM 26 169-14-15.76 674.0335 89-28-15.85 5.790/5.255
DM 26 169-14-14.46 674.0390 89-28-16.18 5.790/5.255
DM 26 169-14-13.16 674.0342 89-28-23.63 5.790/5.255
DE

#DV 31-30 627.5920 89-20-25.95 5.790/5.255 '5REBS LSI CTRL
DV 31-30 627.5877 89-21-09.37 5.740/5.255 '5REBS LSI CTRL

DB 33
DM 30 0-00-00.00 627.5843 89-21-15.20 5.740/5.255
DM 30 359-59-59.68 627.5869 89-21-01.27 5.740/5.255
DM 30 0-00-01.62 627.5870 89-21-10.99 5.740/5.255
DM 30 359-59-56.76 627.5831 89-21-03.21 5.740/5.255
DM 30 0-00-00.00 627.5824 89-21-10.34 5.740/5.255
DM 30 359-59-58.38 627.5852 89-21-00.94 5.740/5.255
DM 20 150-50-01.97 156.6498 90-04-34.10 5.740/5.255
DM 20 150-50-10.07 156.6477 90-04-26.00 5.740/5.255
DM 20 150-50-00.67 156.6537 90-04-37.67 5.740/5.255
DM 20 150-50-04.24 156.6536 90-04-30.86 5.740/5.255
DM 20 150-50-01.97 156.6529 90-04-40.58 5.740/5.255
DM 20 150-50-05.86 156.6480 90-04-29.89 5.740/5.255
DM 26 169-14-06.68 674.0302 89-28-07.75 5.740/5.255
DM 26 169-14-06.68 674.0344 89-28-04.84 5.740/5.255
DM 26 169-14-08.30 674.0327 89-28-10.02 5.740/5.255
DM 26 169-14-09.60 674.0300 89-28-05.81 5.740/5.255
DM 26 169-14-10.57 674.0315 89-28-06.78 5.740/5.255
DM 26 169-14-08.63 674.0303 89-28-08.40 5.740/5.255
DE

DV 33-30 627.5798 89-20-41.50 5.740/5.255 '5REBS LSI CTRL
SS 33-30-1648 30-22-18.66 134.5364 90-01-54.65 5.740/6.500 'PT15
SS 33-30-1649 3-36-15.88 372.6418 90-28-47.02 5.740/6.500 'PT487
SS 33-30-1650 4-42-38.48 332.1483 90-33-36.93 5.740/6.500 '127+10.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1651 5-44-26.66 301.8751 90-34-42.66 5.740/6.500 '126+79.19 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1652 6-55-45.08 273.2888 90-34-18.97 5.740/6.500 '126+50.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1653 10-09-09.14 225.2130 90-43-27.95 5.740/6.500 '126+00.00 R 43.5
SS 33-30-1654 14-10-30.65 177.2269 90-42-46.99 5.740/6.500 '125+50.00 R 42.5
SS 33-30-1655 21-08-38.94 130.7339 90-15-35.68 5.740/6.500 '125+00.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1656 35-43-32.45 88.8922 90-06-06.56 5.740/6.500 '124+50.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1657 68-23-49.31 60.8858 89-32-25.37 5.740/6.500 '124+00.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1658 114-03-20.02 67.1784 89-17-04.47 5.740/6.500 '123+50.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1659 139-25-25.57 101.5986 89-28-04.47 5.740/6.500 '123+00.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1660 150-06-35.39 146.1732 89-43-05.25 5.740/6.500 '122+50.00 R 43.5
SS 33-30-1661 156-50-45.49 192.2029 89-37-37.69 5.740/6.500 '122+00.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1662 160-28-40.51 240.2937 89-33-50.22 5.740/6.500 '121+50.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1663 162-53-17.88 289.0700 89-25-10.88 5.740/6.500 '121+00.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1664 164-36-20.77 338.1732 89-25-00.14 5.740/6.500 '120+50.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1665 165-53-02.87 387.5260 89-17-54.09 5.740/6.500 '120+00.00 R 41.5

DV 33-30 627.5800 89-19-37.04 5.740/5.255 '5REBS LSI CTRL
DV 33-30 627.5796 89-19-49.67 5.740/5.255 '5REBS LSI CTRL
DV 33-30 627.5811 89-19-53.88 5.740/5.255 '5REBS LSI CTRL
DV 33-30 627.5800 89-21-18.44 5.740/5.255 '5REBS LSI CTRL

SS 33-30-1666 165-53-11.94 387.5513 89-16-12.37 5.740/6.500 '120+00.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1667 164-36-15.26 338.1530 89-23-24.57 5.740/6.500 '120+50.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1668 162-53-33.11 289.0644 89-24-01.88 5.740/6.500 '121+00.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1669 160-28-46.99 240.2974 89-32-43.81 5.740/6.500 '121+50.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1670 156-50-59.42 192.1954 89-36-11.85 5.740/6.500 '122+00.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1671 150-06-37.33 146.1647 89-41-48.16 5.740/6.500 '122+50.00 R 43.5
SS 33-30-1672 139-25-14.88 101.6116 89-27-22.69 5.740/6.500 '123+00.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1673 114-03-20.02 67.1900 89-16-30.47 5.740/6.500 '123+50.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1674 68-24-41.47 60.9102 89-33-45.34 5.740/6.500 '124+00.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1675 35-43-59.99 88.8679 90-07-39.83 5.740/6.500 '124+50.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1676 21-08-38.94 130.7366 90-17-19.97 5.740/6.500 '125+00.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1677 14-10-40.04 177.2527 90-44-18.98 5.740/6.500 '125+50.00 R 41.5

DV 33-30 627.5819 89-21-16.82 5.740/5.255 '5REBS LSI CTRL
SS 33-30-1678 10-09-21.13 225.2179 90-44-02.94 5.740/6.500 '126+00.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1679 6-56-06.14 273.2855 90-35-52.92 5.740/6.500 '126+50.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1680 5-44-45.13 301.8563 90-36-25.35 5.740/6.500 '126+79.19 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1681 4-42-57.28 332.1395 90-35-17.35 5.740/6.500 '127+10.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1682 3-36-11.02 372.6367 90-29-28.16 5.740/6.500 'PT487
SS 33-30-1683 166-27-57.53 415.2519 89-20-22.77 5.740/6.500 '119+72.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1684 166-30-11.34 424.2731 89-21-48.61 5.740/6.500 '119+63.00 R 42.5
SS 33-30-1685 167-07-37.63 451.9139 89-15-25.02 5.740/6.500 '119+35.00 R 41.5
SS 33-30-1686 181-31-17.54 516.2971 89-11-25.57 5.740/6.500 'PT457
SS 33-30-1687 179-08-00.85 509.9989 89-09-17.61 5.740/6.500 'PT453
SS 33-30-1688 178-17-59.64 503.2549 89-05-51.25 5.740/6.500 'PT452
SS 33-30-1689 177-40-03.22 493.0121 89-12-26.17 5.740/6.500 'PT451
SS 33-30-1690 177-28-55.13 481.5062 89-11-11.98 5.740/6.500 'PT450
SS 33-30-1691 177-28-55.78 481.4367 89-11-13.93 5.740/6.500 '119+02.96 L 41.5
SS 33-30-1692 177-40-43.39 450.9041 89-09-53.93 5.740/6.500 '119+32.86 L 41.5

DV 33-30 627.5790 89-21-18.11 5.740/5.255 '5REBS LSI CTRL
SS 33-30-1693 177-54-17.28 420.8175 89-14-43.90 5.740/6.500 '119+63.00 L 41.5
SS 33-30-1694 177-58-29.68 411.8555 89-13-58.23 5.740/6.500 '119+72.00 L 41.5
SS 33-30-1695 178-13-27.80 383.8490 89-17-51.18 5.740/6.500 '120+00.00 L 41.5
SS 33-30-1696 178-46-19.67 333.9833 89-22-04.88 5.740/6.500 '120+50.00 L 41.5

DV 33-30 627.5779 89-21-17.47 5.740/5.255 '5REBS LSI CTRL
SS 33-30-1697 179-30-45.86 284.1304 89-24-22.94 5.740/6.500 '121+00.00 L 41.5
SS 33-30-1698 180-33-58.28 234.3338 89-24-30.47 5.740/6.500 '121+50.00 L 41.5
SS 33-30-1699 182-11-05.42 184.7002 89-24-02.09 5.740/6.500 '122+00.00 L 41.5
SS 33-30-1700 185-00-12.13 135.3143 89-34-39.05 5.740/6.500 '122+50.00 L 41.5
SS 33-30-1701 191-00-31.36 86.6035 89-35-07.21 5.740/6.500 '123+00.00 L 41.5
SS 33-30-1702 211-05-52.37 41.1513 89-42-31.50 5.740/6.500 '123+50.00 L 41.5
SS 33-30-1703 299-14-10.43 29.7898 90-48-20.51 5.740/6.500 '124+00.00 L 41.5
SS 33-30-1704 334-26-50.24 71.2765 90-50-37.35 5.740/6.500 '124+50.00 L 41.5
SS 33-30-1705 342-43-54.12 119.4900 90-41-05.92 5.740/6.500 '125+00.00 L 41.5
SS 33-30-1706 346-13-19.81 168.7422 90-33-32.42 5.740/6.500 '125+50.00 L 41.5
SS 33-30-1707 348-07-22.69 218.3324 90-36-15.82 5.740/6.500 '126+00.00 L 41.5
SS 33-30-1708 349-06-50.90 258.1022 90-29-40.04 5.740/6.500 '126+40.00 L 41.5
SS 33-30-1709 349-50-08.41 297.1556 90-32-06.18 5.740/6.500 '126+79.19 L 41.5

DV 33-30 627.5791 89-21-17.79 5.740/5.255 '5REBS LSI CTRL
SS 33-30-1710 350-08-51.72 317.8992 90-28-24.62 5.740/6.500 '127+00.00 L 41.5
SS 33-30-1711 350-31-40.62 347.7932 90-20-02.19 5.740/6.500 '127+30.00 L 41.5
DV 33-30 627.5808 89-21-18.76 5.740/5.255 '5REBS LSI CTRL

 

 

 
Posted : September 20, 2022 8:37 am
Rover83 reacted
Rover83
(@rover83)
Posts: 1601
Member Member
 

Also, I notice that in the photo of the prisms, the offset is printed as -10mm, but in the dataset everything is set to 0mm. Not that it should affect vertical much, but it's another issue that could be contributing.

 

Posted by: @norman-oklahoma

Your first resection set has no Hi/Hr data (assumes 0.00 on both) - which obviously doesn't work.

This could be part of the problem when switching from the resection setup to a single-backsight setup. 

 

Personally, I never enter an instrument height for a true resection - it's always zero. If I'm setting up over a known point I use Station Setup Plus (can't remember the equivalent in SP). No need to do two setups in a row.

 
Posted : September 20, 2022 9:03 am
half bubble
(@half-bubble)
Posts: 920
Member Member
 

Survey Pro once upon a time did resections by averaging the bearing-bearing intersection with the distance-distance intersection. 

 
Posted : September 20, 2022 10:05 am

Get the 2023 SurveyorConnect Wall Calendar

Rover83
(@rover83)
Posts: 1601
Member Member
 
Posted by: @half-bubble

Survey Pro once upon a time did resections by averaging the bearing-bearing intersection with the distance-distance intersection. 

That's interesting, considering that the angles-only solution would be susceptible to geometry issues producing imprecise or even non-unique solutions, and could throw the average solution out of whack.

I have used SP for short periods of time, off and on from about 2007 but don't think I ever saw any screwed up resections.

 
Posted : September 20, 2022 11:46 am
Jaccen
(@jaccen)
Posts: 383
Member Member
 

 

Personally, I never enter an instrument height for a true resection - it's always zero. If I'm setting up over a known point I use Station Setup Plus (can't remember the equivalent in SP). No need to do two setups in a row.

 

I have tried to do this in SurvPC (ie. Advanced Occupation, p.257-266).  Unfortunately, when I tried it, if you want to use both faces with a robot, you have to manually flip it (ie. 2 man setup or a lot of walking).  Granted, that could very well be my misunderstanding of the software or some setting I had done incorrectly.  The manual says it should automatically dump, but it never did for me. *shrug*

 
Posted : September 20, 2022 2:36 pm
half bubble
(@half-bubble)
Posts: 920
Member Member
 
Posted by: @rover83

That's interesting, considering that the angles-only solution would be susceptible to geometry issues producing imprecise or even non-unique solutions, and could throw the average solution out of whack.

I have used SP for short periods of time, off and on from about 2007 but don't think I ever saw any screwed up resections.

In 2009 and 2010 I worked up a 3D free stationing field method using Leica 1200 in the field and expressed as direction sets in Star*Net as an office check. Wrote a paper about it, went to ACSM with it. Roughly 95% of surveyors said "you can't do that!" but 5% (the metrology crowd, including some of our current posters) said "It's a valid way of doing fieldwork with great precision." Those guys either used Leica's "Resection" or booked the turns and took it home to Star*Net, Geolab, MOVE3, or Columbus. One of the most interesting pieces of feedback was that most data collectors did resections and free stations incorrectly, so most field surveyors who could take a data collector and run with it had tried it, been bitten by a many feet wrong bad solution, and never used it again. So many resection routines that got the wrong answer, wouldn't give the right answer, got fired before lunch and were last seen walking home from the edge of town.

I had a mentor, who, if all else failed with regard to control, could sit down and crank out a three point resection on his HP calculator in the passenger seat of the van. You were not allowed to sit in the driver's seat or anywhere else in the van, or that would shake the van, for the next 90 minutes or so. No sudden moves no loud noises. And he never showed me, I wish I had asked, pretty sure I did ask, but he was powering through it everybody stand back, because he's not an easy guy to get along with.

(I should call him, never have in 15 years, although I crashed his table at the conference a while back. He ain't dead yet or I would have heard.)

A three point weighted mean free station by coordinates in two faces on field note paper with an exam approved calculator and being able to teach it is something to which we all might aspire. 

 
Posted : September 20, 2022 5:35 pm
Rover83 reacted

Get the 2023 SurveyorConnect Wall Calendar

Rover83
(@rover83)
Posts: 1601
Member Member
 
Posted by: @half-bubble

One of the most interesting pieces of feedback was that most data collectors did resections and free stations incorrectly, so most field surveyors who could take a data collector and run with it had tried it, been bitten by a many feet wrong bad solution, and never used it again.

This is interesting. I started long after total stations were the standard, so I've only done a handful of angles-only resects in my entire career, and I was super, super paranoid about getting it right, so I always had a check point for after the position was computed.

I also always select the Helmert method if given the option. I got spoiled working with Trimble and Leica because they both offer it, but I don't remember seeing it on other software, at least not on SurvCE or Survey Pro, or even Survey Controller.

 
Posted : September 20, 2022 6:57 pm
mvanhank222
(@mvanhank222)
Posts: 374
Member Member
 

What I ended up doing with survey pro was turn off the elevation of all points but 1 that was about mid range of what I was staking. Then check other points that was the only way I ever felt confident with the vertical results.

 
Posted : September 21, 2022 8:21 am
ArabicaBoy
(@arabicaboy)
Posts: 19
Member Member
 
Posted by: @jaccen

I have tried to do this in SurvPC (ie. Advanced Occupation, p.257-266).  Unfortunately, when I tried it, if you want to use both faces with a robot, you have to manually flip it (ie. 2 man setup or a lot of walking).  Granted, that could very well be my misunderstanding of the software or some setting I had done incorrectly.  The manual says it should automatically dump, but it never did for me. *shrug*

Configure button, Sets tab

  • Auto turn -> checked
  • Auto read -> checked

as seen p.266

It doesn't work for you? It's OK for me.

 
Posted : October 10, 2022 2:58 am
Lurker reacted

Get the 2023 SurveyorConnect Wall Calendar

Page 2 / 2