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ncsudirtman
(@ncsudirtman)
200+ posts Member

Just had this exact scenario with a chain link fence causing the Schonstedt to scream here recently. But the corner was a 50+ yr old ECM according to the recorded maps (the deeds described only points in their calls which had me worried). I was frustrated & frozen after about 30 mins of searching for this one (plus a snappy call from my wife about getting home to help with the kids). But I was lucky enough to literally kick the ground near the calc’d area for my search next to this fence. My steel toe bruised my toenail pretty bad when the toe of the sole of my boot caught a buried portion of the destroyed concrete monument in the one area that I had failed to look but it was worth it 

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Posted : November 23, 2021 10:20 am
BushAxe liked
KScott
(@kscott)
200+ posts Member

The pin-pointer metal detector is a great tool for searching near and under chain-link fences. The Whites pin pointer that I used had a function to set the range of detection. If you could get below the chain link 4" for instance you could set the range at that distance and search under the fence. It only had a maximum range of about 9" but I found many a monument with it, and a shovel!

The truth is that if you expect to find a monument you will find it a great majority of the time.

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Posted : November 23, 2021 11:32 am
dmyhill
(@dmyhill)
1,000+ posts Supporter
Posted by: @paden-cash

 

In the words of a wise old surveyor, "If you're not finding anything you're either looking in the wrong place or not digging deep enough."

 

I dug a three foot deep hole in the middle of a dirt road once. Found nothing. It might have been at 3.5 feet, but I hit my limit. I often wonder about that hole, 3 feet deep and about that in diameter. It was certainly less compact when I got done. I wonder what happened when it rained, is a car stuck in there right now?

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Posted : November 23, 2021 11:38 am

Chris Bouffard
(@chris-bouffard)
200+ posts Member

I was working with one of my mentors back in my green horn days.  We did our initial traverse with a 30" K & E optical transit with me running the gun and found very little in our first go around.  The deed called for a stone on every corner, some of them were in the woods and the others in the open fields of a farm that was tilled and worked since the date of the 100 year old+ deed.

I sat with him after hours while he worked on the ole Wang calculating out and balancing the traverse as he kept looking at me saying, "man, I know they are there, I just know they are".  We had 3 field crews back then (early 80's).  When we all showed up the following day, he sat us all down, explained that he "knows" the stones in the woods had to still be there because of the maturity of the trees, handed us radial stakeout sheets and put a six pack bounty on every stone.

We progressed up the line leap frogging with one crew searching for one, another crew searching for the next and the third crew searching ahead of that eith each crew digging 2' deep, 10' in diameter from the search point, and, by the end of the day, after shoveling allot of yards of dirt, we found most of them.  We came back from the field at the end of the day that Friday and there was two cold cases of beer waiting for us to consume in old school Surveyor fashion.

The property was ultimately developed by Toll Brothers with an 18 hole golf course and a large residential subdivision.  Every time I pass that property, it takes me back to, "man, I know they are there".  Fond memories of a lost art not instilled in the younger generations.

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Posted : November 23, 2021 2:41 pm
holy cow
(@holy-cow)
10,000+ posts Member

Once you have found a second one, you are halfway there, no matter how many you are seeking.  Narrowing down the search zone helps the attitude a great deal.

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Posted : November 23, 2021 2:57 pm
SPMPLS
(@spmpls)
500+ posts Member

Just before I got my license I worked for a utility company for a couple of years. A couple of the party chiefs were mostly worthless (lifers who didn't care). We were looking for a section corner at the intersection of two County roads and got a good signal. The two crew members started chiseling and the PC would wave the wand and say "keep digging." We opened a hole maybe 2.5' wide and 3' deep then finally unearthed a chunk of heavy scrap metal. No more signal. We started to backfill the hole and the PC told us to stop. He went to the survey rig and grabbed more scrap iron, spikes, and whatnot and threw them in the bottom. He then said "fill it up and pack it good. The next surveyor will find even more junk than we did (we?)." Those PC's taught me a lot about things to not do if I wanted to be a good surveyor, including not being a jerk.

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Posted : November 23, 2021 3:19 pm
Brad Ott liked

RADAR
(@dougie)
5,000+ posts Member
Posted by: @gene-kooper

Anyone else use this technique?

All the time

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Posted : November 23, 2021 3:33 pm
Mark Mayer
(@mark-mayer)
1,000+ posts Member
Posted by: @gene-kooper

Anyone else use this technique?

The technique you describe is detailed in the Schonstedt manual. So you might as well ask "have you read the instructions?" Not many have but it is worth the 5 minutes it takes.

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Posted : November 23, 2021 3:54 pm
Bruce Small
(@bruce-small)
1,000+ posts Member

@gene-kooper  Hiya Gene. I used the horizontal metal detector trick on this site, but the pipe was too deep compared to the nearby chain link fence. I also know to watch the display as I slowly move the metal detector. It it goes from 04 to 05 to 07 and back down, something is under there. Even if the display holds steady at 04 I still dig and try again a foot down. 

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Topic starter Posted : November 23, 2021 5:44 pm

Nate The Surveyor
(@nate-the-surveyor)
5,000+ posts Member

@spmpls 

I have found: piece of scrap metal, in rock pile, under 18" of pavement. Set my rebar in concrete, with the top flush. It was an active roadway. 

N

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Posted : November 23, 2021 5:51 pm
Jitterboogie
(@jitterboogie)
1,000+ posts Supporter

@gene-kooper 

Yep!

Learned it from the UXO techs I worked with. Bombs are worse to find when digging than when not digging.

😎

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Posted : November 23, 2021 6:01 pm
Jitterboogie
(@jitterboogie)
1,000+ posts Supporter

Big thing with the fancy tools is to not be too cheap to buy and Insert new batteries more than once every 5 years.

Fresh batteries make a huge difference in the response for tough detector situations.

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Posted : November 23, 2021 6:03 pm

Gene Kooper
(@gene-kooper)
1,000+ posts Member
Posted by: @mark-mayer

The technique you describe is detailed in the Schonstedt manual. So you might as well ask "have you read the instructions?"

Twisting a phrase from an old gold mining movie, "Manual?? We don't need no stinkin' manual."

Obviously, I don't have a manual for my old, trusty GA-52C (but likely my old party chief had access to one in the late 1970s). I appreciate the link, Mark. Thanks.

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Posted : November 23, 2021 6:52 pm
Hblair
(@hblair)
100+ posts Supporter

One of my survey managers I had years ago always said, if you haven't dug a hole you haven't looked.

Found a buried 1913 brass cap yesterday that was 3 feet underground.

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Posted : November 24, 2021 6:13 am
NotSoMuch and RADAR liked
holy cow
(@holy-cow)
10,000+ posts Member

@hblair 

That's worth at least a million attaboys.  Good, and proper, work.

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Posted : November 24, 2021 7:50 am

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